[HondaATC]

Has anyone here ever attempted (Sucessfully, or unsucessfully, I hope to join the former rather than the latter, but I know my luck to be more probably of the latter being firstly ) to build a pipe? I'm fixing to try and put one of these together...

 

[FrankieJames7]

jawz performance would probably put one together if you give them the numbers

if youre looking to make it your self i wish you luck

nice wallpaper btw

better not go outside it looks nasty

 

[HondaATC]

I am going to be trying this one myself...we will see how it goes.

 

[Morph0906]

We expect pics and a thread billy

 

[John Tice]

The book has fabrications tips.

 

[HondaATC]

I plan to document this pretty well - we will see how it goes. my slip roll should be here Wednesday.

John, I actually had that dug out over teh weekend going back through it, there was a few tips on the actual construction side, the most benefitting one I think was to only make cuts as wide (Which would be length way of the pipe) equal to one half the diameter.

The actual construction I am still a little bit confused on what is the best way, whether it is to roll everything out and weld it together in a straight pipe and then come back and cut and section it to snake it around (Been trying this, and making the cuts consistently, and finding a way to hold the #@!$%! pipe from moving while sawing it being such an awkward shape is quite a challenge). I had Grand River Racing run the calcs and weld together a totally straight pipe for me a few years ago for a 500 build that I never used - I'm adapting it now for this build just for shits and giggles and to learn a little bit more about how to snake and turn things around, I would have never used it on a 500 anyways I don't think.

I think what I am going to try on the one I'm building from scratch is basically lay everything out on cardboard, roll it and tape it, then come back and cut into pieces, # & label each individual piece, cut the taper, and transfer back onto sheet metal and then do each individual section as one piece on the slip roll, hopefully that gives me better results. The biggest challenge I've had with the other method is getting the pieces to line up once you've rotated them 180 degrees, insatiably the pipe has ovaled and egg shaped some and your left with a decent sized gap around the side of your joints from one piece to another, that makes for some terrible looking joints when trying to weld it.

 

[John Tice]

Hello Billy; You need to use your new roll & get familiar with it’s operation. Roll up a pile of scraps.
Next if you can do 20ga. Butt welds with no filler rod.
You should be able to build beautiful pipes.
JT

:thumbsup:

 

[ktm550]

might be some videos on youtube how to do it. ive had a couple pipes made and they dont make a straight pipe then hacksaw it in sections :Laugh5:. im thinking they start at the cylinder and work their way to the end, contouring around the frame, radiators etc. i would think theres some kind of program they use that calculates all the sections then prints paper templates

 

[HondaATC]

Yeah, that program is on the right hand side of the screenshot I posted. Its called Cone Layout...pretty handy.

 

[HondaATC]

Well I have my slip roll and I've been playing around on it with the sections from an old CR500 pipe I'm working on. For the life of me, I cannot figure out yet how these guys that make these things get consistently good and tight enough joints that they do in the sectioning. I *assumed* I could re-run the pieces through the slip roll and take the oval out of them, so that when they are turned 180 degrees they would fit up nicely, but it doesn't really seem to be working that way...

Not giving up on it yet by any means, but dang, theres gotta be a trick or two I haven't figured out yet

 

[Larry's Shee]

The proper way is to do a "pie cut". Basically cut straight halfway then pie cut other half. rotate 180 and insert pie on oppisite side.
Only good example of this I know of is in G. Jennings book. May be something in Bell, don't remember.
I used poster board for my mock-up.

When done you can tell everyone why it costs so much for a one-off custom pipe.

Been there, done that. :Banghead1:

 

[HondaATC]

Well thats exactly what I'm doing, but the problem is the joints do not fit up worth a crap once I rotate it 180 degrees. I'm not sure if its my method of cutting or what, but thats just not working for me...Basically the pipe is ovaled out, so when you turn it the other way, the ovals don't match up. Pretty much turning it any direction or orientation other than how it was when you cut makes big gaps and pretty gnarly looking joints. I've even re-ran these pieces through the slip roll to try and round them back out and it doesn't seem to make any difference. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong really

 

[ktm550]

constructing the pipe initially is childs play for some one experienced. what sends the price through the roof is taking it apart 20 times and changing the dimensions trying to find the most power

should be videos on youtube showing how to do it

 

[HondaATC]

I have tried many methods these past few weeks to try and make this work, and I think I am real close to being able to pull it off finally.

 

[ktm550]

you might contact some of the pipe makers around the country. im sure they would gladly give you advice. i havent attempted to make a pipe but ive had a couple made specifically for my bike. meaning i had to take the bike to their shop and they make it right to the bike. it didnt take them long.

 

[seattle smitty]

constructing the pipe initially is childs play for some one experienced. what sends the price through the roof is taking it apart 20 times and changing the dimensions trying to find the most power.

What KTM said there ought to tell you that having to do some grinding on the edges of the sections to get good fit-ups for welding should not lead you to worry too much about losing some dimension you get from a software program or whatever. Those programs give the illusion that their dims are right-on-the-money, having been calculated mathematically. This illusion of accuracy is rather like what you get with a set of 6" electronic calipers that read clear down to tenths of thousands when the jaws of the calipers are not capable of such accuracy (nor are most users). Make good-fitting joints and weld them up and try the result. Maybe one pipe will come in a few hundred rpm before the other. Is that necessarily bad? It might actually make the bike more pleasant to ride.

You can build some tunability into your pipes, if you want. Instead of rolling the big straight section of the pipe according to the dimensions you got from a software program, fabricate it as a 2-piece straight section with snug-fitting but moveable inner and outer pieces. Then you can test the pipe(s) with different lengths of center section. In other words, the megaphone half of the pipe, from the cylinder out to the straight section, remains fixed, but from the center section out to the baffle-cone and stinger, it's adjustable. Kart racers used to do this years ago, maybe still do for all I know. They could lengthen their pipe for short tracks where they wanted the torque to come in at a lower rpm, and shorten the pipe for a track with lots of long, high-rpm straights.
So, while you could find the length that you liked, and replace the sliding section with the usual fixed, continuous, one-piece pipe, you might find that you want to retain the option to adjust the pipes.

 

[camatv]

the cone program has the ability to make angles for turns also.

the trick it takes some math to do the full sections in the degree's of bend you want. after thinking about it for about 2 days i figured out how to get the angle of bend AND the length of each section depending on how many sections i wanted to use. more sections means better curve, BUT also much much more welding. after figuring that out then the cone programe can make the shapes for you i then would print them out , cut them out, and transfer them to the sheet steel.. OR if you have any access to anyone with a decent plasma cutter the program can spit out a cut pattern for the plasma. much much much easier ( but still can make big mistakes... )

a LARGE cone shaped anvil or large cone vertical looks like the best way to straighten the pipe sections out. making a full length pipe and "pie cutting" takes forever. i never tried that method because of the wacko pipe looks and the really complicated compared to individual sections way of building the pipe.

i made one and finished it for my cr500 trike. i have never posted pics of it because of all the ridicule i got from other forums for attempting to make it. it pulled way harder than the ftz i had built.. but it was the size of a trashcan... ( on purpose he he)

i have about 6 other multiple designed pipes for banshee's that are cut out and ready to build. but i made the mistake of making the front sections out of way to many smaller sections. they took forever to weld and i got pissed at the whole process. also the tig i was using went through a full BIG bottle of gas just doing 1 and one small section of another pipe... i have purchased a smaller tungsten and will try smaller wire and smaller tungsten if i ever pull them all out and try it again...

 

[HondaATC]

I just received word from my buddy in Germany yesterday that the templates I sent him in flat .dxf file for 2 pipes each in stainless and also steel are ready to be shipped to me.

Laser cutting, material (for 4 pipes), exchange rate, and shipping, about 1/4 of what a new out frame pipe is.

and cam, I did figure out the math to divide up the sections, but you still have to coordinate and size each individual section into Cone Layout, I didn't find or figure out anyways for it to divide them up automatically? I had actually emailed the guy that makes the program asking him about that, but never got a reply back.

I wound up with 52 sections total on my pipe.

I tried building one already sometime back (didn't go very well) and I found that moving from actual tig rod (even if it was 1/16th) to mig wire made a WHOLE lot of a difference and worked a helluva lot better. Post some pics of yours...no ridicule here

 

[HondaATC]

Here is my "pipe anvil"

 

[John Tice]

Nice Work bench
ope: